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Professional Detailer's Association
Posted by Brian Angelucci
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Professional Detailer's Association May 19, 2004 03:46AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>It's been long overdure that us detailers have an association of our own. I do know that the ICA acquired the Professional Detailer's Asscoation but how many of us benefit from that? It's hardly in existence anymore.
The insurance dilemma that we have been facing is still a problem. Here are some responses I've gotten when calling around for insurance: "Unfortunately, there is no market for your type of business"; "Being a sole proprietor with no employees wouldn't make us money" and my favorite "We'd only make $20 a year if we gave you a policy. However, I did have an agency that would give me a policy if I only did boats and no cars. I firmly believe that a PDA would benefit us all for an insurance factor.
Farmers and mechanics created credit unions because because of the steep fees and charges from the banks.
So back to the original question, Who would be interested in joining a Detailer's Association if one was to be created? How much would you be willing to pay a year? Would you attend golf outtings, meeting, dinners, conventions?
This would be basically for just detailers (mobile and fixed) and cosmetic appearance installers. Paint spotters are welcome.
If enough people are interested, I will look deeper into this and seriously create one with.
Right now, I'm looking into a merger with a fellow MobileWorks member.
That is also another benefit, mergers mergers and more mergers.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
The insurance dilemma that we have been facing is still a problem. Here are some responses I've gotten when calling around for insurance: "Unfortunately, there is no market for your type of business"; "Being a sole proprietor with no employees wouldn't make us money" and my favorite "We'd only make $20 a year if we gave you a policy. However, I did have an agency that would give me a policy if I only did boats and no cars. I firmly believe that a PDA would benefit us all for an insurance factor.
Farmers and mechanics created credit unions because because of the steep fees and charges from the banks.
So back to the original question, Who would be interested in joining a Detailer's Association if one was to be created? How much would you be willing to pay a year? Would you attend golf outtings, meeting, dinners, conventions?
This would be basically for just detailers (mobile and fixed) and cosmetic appearance installers. Paint spotters are welcome.
If enough people are interested, I will look deeper into this and seriously create one with.
Right now, I'm looking into a merger with a fellow MobileWorks member.
That is also another benefit, mergers mergers and more mergers.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 04:30AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Brian:
A bit of history regarding the Professional Detailing Association. In 1989 I got a group of manufacturers of chemicals and equipment together at the ICA Expo in Rosemont, Illinois for the purpose of establishing a detailing association.
All those present agreed to put $200 seed money to try and get something going.
After that meeting I contacted just about every supplier and manufacture to the detailing industry I could. When we got about 20 companies to put up $200 we then drew up some by-laws; incorporated as a non-profit organization and formally established the Professional Detailing Association.
The organization was set up to have officers elected from the Board of Directors. Each segment of the industry was represented on the Board by three seats; manufacturer; distributor and operator.
We then set out to get members from all segments are were successful in getting a reasonably good membership going.
I was the executive director for about 1.5 years and then we hired a part-time executive director who grew the association to over 500 members.
We had a quarterly magazine; a monthly newsletter and a Detailing Pavillion at the ICA Expo and put on the detailing seminars at the Expo.
We had conducted 15 seminars all over the country that were attended by a minimum of 100 detailers per location.
We were booming and that all ended when we merged with the ICA.
Of course, the reason the ICA seemingly does nothing for the detailing segment is that the detailers do not join the association.
Most of the major suppliers to the industry are members, but missing are the detailers.
If you want insurance you can get it thru a membership in ICA along with all types of "how to run your business information." All for free as a part of your membership.
As for the PDA getting insurance for detailers that is a "pipe dream." We worked on that and ran into deadends every step of the way. So do not think an association of operators would get you any insurance.
The best thing that came out of the PDA were the relationships that developed between a number of people, including a lot of detailers around the country that came together in this organization.
Keep in mind too, that those who really particpated spent their own money and time to attend meetings, etc.
Any chance for a detailing association to come into existence again must come from the manufacturers who have the seed money that is needed to do what I described was needed.
Could it be done again, YES. But it will take a leader with money, time and a passion to simply create the association again.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
A bit of history regarding the Professional Detailing Association. In 1989 I got a group of manufacturers of chemicals and equipment together at the ICA Expo in Rosemont, Illinois for the purpose of establishing a detailing association.
All those present agreed to put $200 seed money to try and get something going.
After that meeting I contacted just about every supplier and manufacture to the detailing industry I could. When we got about 20 companies to put up $200 we then drew up some by-laws; incorporated as a non-profit organization and formally established the Professional Detailing Association.
The organization was set up to have officers elected from the Board of Directors. Each segment of the industry was represented on the Board by three seats; manufacturer; distributor and operator.
We then set out to get members from all segments are were successful in getting a reasonably good membership going.
I was the executive director for about 1.5 years and then we hired a part-time executive director who grew the association to over 500 members.
We had a quarterly magazine; a monthly newsletter and a Detailing Pavillion at the ICA Expo and put on the detailing seminars at the Expo.
We had conducted 15 seminars all over the country that were attended by a minimum of 100 detailers per location.
We were booming and that all ended when we merged with the ICA.
Of course, the reason the ICA seemingly does nothing for the detailing segment is that the detailers do not join the association.
Most of the major suppliers to the industry are members, but missing are the detailers.
If you want insurance you can get it thru a membership in ICA along with all types of "how to run your business information." All for free as a part of your membership.
As for the PDA getting insurance for detailers that is a "pipe dream." We worked on that and ran into deadends every step of the way. So do not think an association of operators would get you any insurance.
The best thing that came out of the PDA were the relationships that developed between a number of people, including a lot of detailers around the country that came together in this organization.
Keep in mind too, that those who really particpated spent their own money and time to attend meetings, etc.
Any chance for a detailing association to come into existence again must come from the manufacturers who have the seed money that is needed to do what I described was needed.
Could it be done again, YES. But it will take a leader with money, time and a passion to simply create the association again.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 05:15AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>Bud,
Thank you very much for that post. What you wrote is exactly what I want started. I have the time and passion but how much money are you talking?
As for contacting manufacturers, Stoner will be on my list of first calls. They are very helpful and "detailer friendly" when it comes to the industry. In the past few months, I've been talking with a rep there and it seems they bend over backwards to help out the detailer and to save him/her money. My cousin will, I'm sure, join. He's the Auto Magic distributor in my region (Western/Central NJ and Eastern, PA.) I'm very sure Detail Plus will help out too!
And for the insurance part, "where there's a will, there's a way."
Like Dan at Mobileworks slogan: By Detailer - For Detailers - About Detailers (NO CARWASHES)
$200 per person annually is a very good deal PLUS it's a business expense.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
Thank you very much for that post. What you wrote is exactly what I want started. I have the time and passion but how much money are you talking?
As for contacting manufacturers, Stoner will be on my list of first calls. They are very helpful and "detailer friendly" when it comes to the industry. In the past few months, I've been talking with a rep there and it seems they bend over backwards to help out the detailer and to save him/her money. My cousin will, I'm sure, join. He's the Auto Magic distributor in my region (Western/Central NJ and Eastern, PA.) I'm very sure Detail Plus will help out too!
And for the insurance part, "where there's a will, there's a way."
Like Dan at Mobileworks slogan: By Detailer - For Detailers - About Detailers (NO CARWASHES)
$200 per person annually is a very good deal PLUS it's a business expense.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 05:43AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 201 |
<HTML>$200 per year is a 1/2 day of work for some of you guys! I feel the possible benefits far outweigh that amount of money. I'd put up that and then some to be a part of something just for detailers. I'd do some legwork from CA if it's helpful. One Grand, Meguires, Auto Magic, and Supreme are near me.
R Regan</HTML>
R Regan</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 10:37AM |
<HTML>Brian, count me in as well. As you folks know I'm new to the business, but you learn quicker when you have your "Feet put to the Fire" so to speak! Maybe we can have a get together sometime this summer or at least a conference call to discuss a get together.....I can come and go as I please so to speak, so let me know. If you guys don't want some one as small and new to the business as I am, I can understand and won't hurt my feelings abit............................Brandy :-)</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 12:47PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
<HTML>My question to everyone is this: how many of you are members of the ICA? How many of you even attended the World Car Care Expo this year? I would bet that no one can say yes to either questions other than Bud and myself. We have an organization already that will represent us IF WE JOIN AND MAKE OURSELVES HEARD. I doubt there are 50 stand alone detail operations in North America that are part of the ICA - that's just sad. IMHO it's because we collectively as detailers have not earned the respect of the rest of the car care industry because detailers typically do not act professionally. We do need representation - that much is clear. How we go about doing that is the question. I suggest that anyone serious about having a trade organization join the ICA for one year and make yourself heard that you want more recognition for the detailing trade. No one is going to do it unless you ask or tell them to. I for one have applied to be part of the detailing advisory board at the ICA and can hopefully bring about some change through particiapation. I hope some others will do the same.</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 01:24PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Brian:
You do seem to have the passion, but I do not know where you would get the time and still have time to operate your detailing business. I pulled it off because the staff in my office did all the work.
MONEY? It will take thousands of dollars.
We had the will, but the way was blocked for INSURANCE. We worked for 5 years and never got any insurance company to bite. Why worry, the ICA offers a policy and you only have to pay $225 for membership in the association.
DISTRIBUTORS? A joke they were the only group we could not get to join. Over the 5 years we existed before the merger, we have very few distributor members. Their attitude was, "what's in it for me?' And most were too stupid to see the answer.
We never filled the 3 seats on the Board with distributors.
DUES? $200? Good luck. Even when the ICA dues were only $175 detailerd did not join. Now their dues are only $225 and few detailers join.
Seminars - Professional Carwashing & Detailing sponsored a series of 6 detailing seminars in all parts of the country and the highest number of attendees they had at any one seminar was 20 and that one had a family of 6 in attendance.
Do not take my comments as negative, I know personally that a detailing association could be resurrected, but it will take the manufacturers; money and someone with more time than yourself.
Regards
Bud A</HTML>
buda
You do seem to have the passion, but I do not know where you would get the time and still have time to operate your detailing business. I pulled it off because the staff in my office did all the work.
MONEY? It will take thousands of dollars.
We had the will, but the way was blocked for INSURANCE. We worked for 5 years and never got any insurance company to bite. Why worry, the ICA offers a policy and you only have to pay $225 for membership in the association.
DISTRIBUTORS? A joke they were the only group we could not get to join. Over the 5 years we existed before the merger, we have very few distributor members. Their attitude was, "what's in it for me?' And most were too stupid to see the answer.
We never filled the 3 seats on the Board with distributors.
DUES? $200? Good luck. Even when the ICA dues were only $175 detailerd did not join. Now their dues are only $225 and few detailers join.
Seminars - Professional Carwashing & Detailing sponsored a series of 6 detailing seminars in all parts of the country and the highest number of attendees they had at any one seminar was 20 and that one had a family of 6 in attendance.
Do not take my comments as negative, I know personally that a detailing association could be resurrected, but it will take the manufacturers; money and someone with more time than yourself.
Regards
Bud A</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 01:24PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Brian:
You do seem to have the passion, but I do not know where you would get the time and still have time to operate your detailing business. I pulled it off because the staff in my office did all the work.
MONEY? It will take thousands of dollars.
We had the will, but the way was blocked for INSURANCE. We worked for 5 years and never got any insurance company to bite. Why worry, the ICA offers a policy and you only have to pay $225 for membership in the association.
DISTRIBUTORS? A joke they were the only group we could not get to join. Over the 5 years we existed before the merger, we have very few distributor members. Their attitude was, "what's in it for me?' And most were too stupid to see the answer.
We never filled the 3 seats on the Board with distributors.
DUES? $200? Good luck. Even when the ICA dues were only $175 detailerd did not join. Now their dues are only $225 and few detailers join.
Seminars - Professional Carwashing & Detailing sponsored a series of 6 detailing seminars in all parts of the country and the highest number of attendees they had at any one seminar was 20 and that one had a family of 6 in attendance.
Do not take my comments as negative, I know personally that a detailing association could be resurrected, but it will take the manufacturers; money and someone with more time than yourself.
Regards
Bud A</HTML>
buda
You do seem to have the passion, but I do not know where you would get the time and still have time to operate your detailing business. I pulled it off because the staff in my office did all the work.
MONEY? It will take thousands of dollars.
We had the will, but the way was blocked for INSURANCE. We worked for 5 years and never got any insurance company to bite. Why worry, the ICA offers a policy and you only have to pay $225 for membership in the association.
DISTRIBUTORS? A joke they were the only group we could not get to join. Over the 5 years we existed before the merger, we have very few distributor members. Their attitude was, "what's in it for me?' And most were too stupid to see the answer.
We never filled the 3 seats on the Board with distributors.
DUES? $200? Good luck. Even when the ICA dues were only $175 detailerd did not join. Now their dues are only $225 and few detailers join.
Seminars - Professional Carwashing & Detailing sponsored a series of 6 detailing seminars in all parts of the country and the highest number of attendees they had at any one seminar was 20 and that one had a family of 6 in attendance.
Do not take my comments as negative, I know personally that a detailing association could be resurrected, but it will take the manufacturers; money and someone with more time than yourself.
Regards
Bud A</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 01:27PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Rob:
Meguiar's was an original member. Auto Magic is based in Dallas and you would have to have David Miller's approval. He has not been receptive to any attempts at a resurrection of the PDA.
The effort has to be centralized in one place to get it off the ground.
We had two regional associations one in Southern Cal but they folded due to lack of interest and leadership.
Bud A</HTML>
buda
Meguiar's was an original member. Auto Magic is based in Dallas and you would have to have David Miller's approval. He has not been receptive to any attempts at a resurrection of the PDA.
The effort has to be centralized in one place to get it off the ground.
We had two regional associations one in Southern Cal but they folded due to lack of interest and leadership.
Bud A</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 01:27PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Rob:
Meguiar's was an original member. Auto Magic is based in Dallas and you would have to have David Miller's approval. He has not been receptive to any attempts at a resurrection of the PDA.
The effort has to be centralized in one place to get it off the ground.
We had two regional associations one in Southern Cal but they folded due to lack of interest and leadership.
Bud A</HTML>
buda
Meguiar's was an original member. Auto Magic is based in Dallas and you would have to have David Miller's approval. He has not been receptive to any attempts at a resurrection of the PDA.
The effort has to be centralized in one place to get it off the ground.
We had two regional associations one in Southern Cal but they folded due to lack of interest and leadership.
Bud A</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 01:35PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Scott:
You are a bright young man. Your question is the answer to this discussion. "How many are members of ICA?"
Few if any, and that is the reason that ICA does not spend a lot of effort on the detailing industry because when they spent thousands after the merger the detailers did not step up so they said, why spend the money? No one cares. And, as you say, the detail industry still "does not care" as evidenced by the lack of members in the ICA and at the trade show.
They have an Advisory Board representing detailers and they struggle to find good detailers to appoint. Often the same people are on the Board.
As you say, the detailers talk a lot but few join in.
As an old cousin of mine used to say, "Money talks, BS walks." And we have a lot of walking going on here.
Let's see if we can get you all organized. There is a trade show in Orlando in January, the Mobile Tech; Trim and Detail Expo.
The show will conducting an all day seminar on detailing the day before the show which I will put on. The cost is only $75 including free admission to the show. If we can get enough of you signed up for the show and/or seminar I will personally sponsor a meeting to see how many would be interested in organizing the detail industry.
Let's say, 100 people to attend. If that happens I would again lead the effort to create an association.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
You are a bright young man. Your question is the answer to this discussion. "How many are members of ICA?"
Few if any, and that is the reason that ICA does not spend a lot of effort on the detailing industry because when they spent thousands after the merger the detailers did not step up so they said, why spend the money? No one cares. And, as you say, the detail industry still "does not care" as evidenced by the lack of members in the ICA and at the trade show.
They have an Advisory Board representing detailers and they struggle to find good detailers to appoint. Often the same people are on the Board.
As you say, the detailers talk a lot but few join in.
As an old cousin of mine used to say, "Money talks, BS walks." And we have a lot of walking going on here.
Let's see if we can get you all organized. There is a trade show in Orlando in January, the Mobile Tech; Trim and Detail Expo.
The show will conducting an all day seminar on detailing the day before the show which I will put on. The cost is only $75 including free admission to the show. If we can get enough of you signed up for the show and/or seminar I will personally sponsor a meeting to see how many would be interested in organizing the detail industry.
Let's say, 100 people to attend. If that happens I would again lead the effort to create an association.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 02:07PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 201 |
<HTML>Scott,
Your points are well grounded. I was a member of ICA when I detailed, but there were probably 25 detailers in my town who were not...I think I was the only one. I saw membership as a sign of professionalism. Plus, the information in a thick binder I received was great. It contained all kinds of ad ideas, maketing tips, surveys, etc.
As a teacher, many of us belong to CTA (CA Teachers Association). There are the monthly newsletters, meetings, etc. One of the reasons so many teachers join is that you receive free legal aide should anything pop up during your career. Most importantly, I feel the membership is good because you get up to the minute strategies and teaching ideas. Just like this the Detailing Assocation would provide up to the min. ideas, strategies, techniques, etc. The annual meetings/workshops would be great! I'd love to work on my 5.6 handicap on the golf course one of the those days!
Bud, you have talked about this for a while, that an Association of sorts would help in the overall professionalism of the trade as seen by the public. I know for years you have spoken to the notion that the public still views detailing as a "back alley business" to some degree and some of the blame is on the detailer.
An association may help to negate the negative connotation people have. When you meet with a customer, how many times do they comment, "I can get wash for $8 down the street."? Do you go into your doctor's office and say, "I can get an exam from Dr. X for less than your price." I think collectively we need to do more for our own profession. I know many of you feel the same way. Is the association part of the equation? If so, I'd be very interested in putting in time and money.
These are my early morning ramblings so I apologize if I have misrepresented anyones statements or opinions.
Have a great day,
R Regan</HTML>
Your points are well grounded. I was a member of ICA when I detailed, but there were probably 25 detailers in my town who were not...I think I was the only one. I saw membership as a sign of professionalism. Plus, the information in a thick binder I received was great. It contained all kinds of ad ideas, maketing tips, surveys, etc.
As a teacher, many of us belong to CTA (CA Teachers Association). There are the monthly newsletters, meetings, etc. One of the reasons so many teachers join is that you receive free legal aide should anything pop up during your career. Most importantly, I feel the membership is good because you get up to the minute strategies and teaching ideas. Just like this the Detailing Assocation would provide up to the min. ideas, strategies, techniques, etc. The annual meetings/workshops would be great! I'd love to work on my 5.6 handicap on the golf course one of the those days!
Bud, you have talked about this for a while, that an Association of sorts would help in the overall professionalism of the trade as seen by the public. I know for years you have spoken to the notion that the public still views detailing as a "back alley business" to some degree and some of the blame is on the detailer.
An association may help to negate the negative connotation people have. When you meet with a customer, how many times do they comment, "I can get wash for $8 down the street."? Do you go into your doctor's office and say, "I can get an exam from Dr. X for less than your price." I think collectively we need to do more for our own profession. I know many of you feel the same way. Is the association part of the equation? If so, I'd be very interested in putting in time and money.
These are my early morning ramblings so I apologize if I have misrepresented anyones statements or opinions.
Have a great day,
R Regan</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 02:07PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 20 |
<HTML>alot of good posts here and again I learned something new. I take my detailing business very serious as I am sure everyone else does.How do I join the ICA and where do you get info. about the trade show Bud A. is talking about in Orlando? I.m all for helping in any way I can!!!</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 03:11PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 03:11PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 05:25PM |
<HTML>My view of what a Professional Detailing Association should be varies greatly from others. I do not see an association that's focused on us, the detailers. Contrary to most, I clearly see an association that's focused on the 'needs of our customers' and especially our potential customers. The people driving around in their dirty cars who know very little about what we 'detailers' have to offer.
To me, it all about being market driven. This marketing axiom says it best; 'Find A Need And Fill It'. I believe the most important thing in business is to always remain focused on the needs of the customer. The person who's willing to pay for what it is that's being offered. After all, the customer is the
primary reason we are all in business.
To many of us this is basic marketing 101. It's a rather simple statement. Find someone who needs the product or service that we offer and then fill that need. Along the same lines comes the following; 1- who is the customer?, 2- why does the customer need what we offer? Basic marketing. Right?
I mention this phrase because many of us, would sometimes like to just continue to do things the way we've always done them. It's easy to understand. It's almost always fun and it's the way we know best. Hey, doing things the way we've always done them got us this far. Right?
When we're busy doing things the way we've always done them; how often do we ask ourselves the above questions? As our businesses have grown; do we spend too much time our own needs? rather than the needs of our customer? Are we still trying to 'find a need and fill it'?
Now most will say 'of course I'm focused on the needs of my customer'. 'That's why I'm in business'. Well, maybe we're just not as focused as we can be. Can we do better? How can we improve and become more focused on the needs of our customers and potential customers, too?
Do we ever stop and think about how we are all at different levels in this industry? Some are newbies, some driveway detailers, some own stand alone detail shops, some do mobile detailing, some do only wholesale work, some only re-conditioning type detailing, some do car dealer washing and prep, some do RVs and motorhomes, some do boats, some do power washing of tractor and trailers, some do express detailing, some do extreme detailing, some do simple detailing, some offer equipment, some offer products, some offer services and information about detailing.
The point is this; we are all different. We are all at different levels. We all come from different backgrounds. And yes we all have much to offer. One thing is for sure; we can learn from each other.
How would we answer these questions with regard to establishing a 'new' Professional Detailing Association? Is there really a need?
Unanswered questions...
1- who is the customer?
2- why does the customer need what we offer?
3- Basic marketing. Right?
4- doing things the way we've always done them got us this far. Right?
5- As our businesses have grown; do we spend too much time on our own needs? rather than the needs of our customer?
6- Are we still trying to 'find a need and fill it'?
7- Can we do better? How can we improve and become more focused on the needs of our customers and potential customers, too?
8- Do we ever stop and think about how we are all at different levels in this industry?
Anyone have any further thoughts...</HTML>
To me, it all about being market driven. This marketing axiom says it best; 'Find A Need And Fill It'. I believe the most important thing in business is to always remain focused on the needs of the customer. The person who's willing to pay for what it is that's being offered. After all, the customer is the
primary reason we are all in business.
To many of us this is basic marketing 101. It's a rather simple statement. Find someone who needs the product or service that we offer and then fill that need. Along the same lines comes the following; 1- who is the customer?, 2- why does the customer need what we offer? Basic marketing. Right?
I mention this phrase because many of us, would sometimes like to just continue to do things the way we've always done them. It's easy to understand. It's almost always fun and it's the way we know best. Hey, doing things the way we've always done them got us this far. Right?
When we're busy doing things the way we've always done them; how often do we ask ourselves the above questions? As our businesses have grown; do we spend too much time our own needs? rather than the needs of our customer? Are we still trying to 'find a need and fill it'?
Now most will say 'of course I'm focused on the needs of my customer'. 'That's why I'm in business'. Well, maybe we're just not as focused as we can be. Can we do better? How can we improve and become more focused on the needs of our customers and potential customers, too?
Do we ever stop and think about how we are all at different levels in this industry? Some are newbies, some driveway detailers, some own stand alone detail shops, some do mobile detailing, some do only wholesale work, some only re-conditioning type detailing, some do car dealer washing and prep, some do RVs and motorhomes, some do boats, some do power washing of tractor and trailers, some do express detailing, some do extreme detailing, some do simple detailing, some offer equipment, some offer products, some offer services and information about detailing.
The point is this; we are all different. We are all at different levels. We all come from different backgrounds. And yes we all have much to offer. One thing is for sure; we can learn from each other.
How would we answer these questions with regard to establishing a 'new' Professional Detailing Association? Is there really a need?
Unanswered questions...
1- who is the customer?
2- why does the customer need what we offer?
3- Basic marketing. Right?
4- doing things the way we've always done them got us this far. Right?
5- As our businesses have grown; do we spend too much time on our own needs? rather than the needs of our customer?
6- Are we still trying to 'find a need and fill it'?
7- Can we do better? How can we improve and become more focused on the needs of our customers and potential customers, too?
8- Do we ever stop and think about how we are all at different levels in this industry?
Anyone have any further thoughts...</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 06:08PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Frank:
That is a nice idealistic view, but not realistic for an association.
An detailing association exists for one purpose, to help detailers become more professional technically and in operating their businesses. Part of this is how to better communicate and serve the needs of the customer.
Also, if the industry has nationwide problems then it is the association that represents the industy. For example, issues on water discharge would be handled by the association. Or, issues dealing with cars would be handled by an association executive who meets with the Auto Manufacturers. In fact, ICA has an ex-Ford executive who is a liason to the manufacturers on issues that affect carwashes.
That is my take on it.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
That is a nice idealistic view, but not realistic for an association.
An detailing association exists for one purpose, to help detailers become more professional technically and in operating their businesses. Part of this is how to better communicate and serve the needs of the customer.
Also, if the industry has nationwide problems then it is the association that represents the industy. For example, issues on water discharge would be handled by the association. Or, issues dealing with cars would be handled by an association executive who meets with the Auto Manufacturers. In fact, ICA has an ex-Ford executive who is a liason to the manufacturers on issues that affect carwashes.
That is my take on it.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 06:42PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 20 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 06:51PM |
<HTML>HI John,
You can shoot me an email at: canna@verizon.net
and my website is at: [mysite.verizon.net];
You can shoot me an email at: canna@verizon.net
and my website is at: [mysite.verizon.net];
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 07:53PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 20 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 19, 2004 10:43PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>I just reviewed the entire ICA website and it's very limited to detailers. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure it's a great Association but beneficial more for the carwashers. Just like Professional Carwashing & Detailing -- great magazine but only 10 pages dedicated to the detailing industry.
Scott, I totally understand and respect everything you're saying but the fact remains that we shouldn't have to speak up and be heard. Yes it's sadly true, we don't receive the recognition and respect we should because of the bad apples that that are publicly seen in our industry. Personally, I don't believe I would join an Association with carwashers due to the fact that I don't have any interest in networking with carwashers -- just detailers and suppliers.
Also, $200 isn't much at all. Like Rob said, that's a half a day to a days pay for some of us. We wouldn't want hacks in our Association anyway, right? Plus, it's a business tax write off. Now I could join the Carwash Opeators of New Jersey for $100 a year but feel the same way about this as I do the ICA.
A representative and Association of just detailers is what we need.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
Scott, I totally understand and respect everything you're saying but the fact remains that we shouldn't have to speak up and be heard. Yes it's sadly true, we don't receive the recognition and respect we should because of the bad apples that that are publicly seen in our industry. Personally, I don't believe I would join an Association with carwashers due to the fact that I don't have any interest in networking with carwashers -- just detailers and suppliers.
Also, $200 isn't much at all. Like Rob said, that's a half a day to a days pay for some of us. We wouldn't want hacks in our Association anyway, right? Plus, it's a business tax write off. Now I could join the Carwash Opeators of New Jersey for $100 a year but feel the same way about this as I do the ICA.
A representative and Association of just detailers is what we need.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 20, 2004 01:41AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
<HTML>Brian, unfortunately we do have to speak up to be heard because if we don't do it - no one else is going to do it for us. Being part of the ICA has nothing to do with networking with car wash owners unless you want it to. I joined because I was lucky enough to meet up with a few other like minded detailers who were very successful and were more than willing to help me become more successful. The changes I made in my business since brainstorming with these people have made a significant difference in my operations and profit margins. Join or don't join - it doesn't affect me one iota. I have no vested interest in anyone joining other than to get more successful people involved and sharing.</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 20, 2004 01:58AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Scott:
Great post to Brian. Far too many detailers have this "holier than thou" attitude which is really self-defeating in the long run.
For years the carwash operators had this same attitude about oil companies. They would have nothing to do with oil companies even though they were in the carwash business. In fact, many operators had gas, but they did not want oil companies in "THEIR" carwash association.
When the ICA got rid of the "good old boys" attitude and broadened their horizons they invited the oil companies to participate in the association and it did wonders for the carwash industry.
The attitude that Brian conveys is very similiar. The carwash industry is very active in the detailing business, and like it or not they will be in it for the long run.
Detailers can learn a great deal from successful carwash operators on how to operate a business, and detailers can give operators a great deal of information on to incorporate detailing into their washes, and even how to be better detailers.
Many detailers made find a friend in an operator who would lease their detailing space to the detailer. What a ready made gold mine for a detailer.
As you say, your attitude is your attitude and if Brian cares to listen he might learn something. If he does not it doesn't affect you in the least.
Right now all the industry has is the ICA and if they want it to be more responsive to the needs of the detail industry the detailers have to speak up and tell them what they want and need. If you do not join you can't speak.
As it is, the ICA has a great amount of how to run a business information that a detailer could use. But, most are not looking for that, only how to detail.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
Great post to Brian. Far too many detailers have this "holier than thou" attitude which is really self-defeating in the long run.
For years the carwash operators had this same attitude about oil companies. They would have nothing to do with oil companies even though they were in the carwash business. In fact, many operators had gas, but they did not want oil companies in "THEIR" carwash association.
When the ICA got rid of the "good old boys" attitude and broadened their horizons they invited the oil companies to participate in the association and it did wonders for the carwash industry.
The attitude that Brian conveys is very similiar. The carwash industry is very active in the detailing business, and like it or not they will be in it for the long run.
Detailers can learn a great deal from successful carwash operators on how to operate a business, and detailers can give operators a great deal of information on to incorporate detailing into their washes, and even how to be better detailers.
Many detailers made find a friend in an operator who would lease their detailing space to the detailer. What a ready made gold mine for a detailer.
As you say, your attitude is your attitude and if Brian cares to listen he might learn something. If he does not it doesn't affect you in the least.
Right now all the industry has is the ICA and if they want it to be more responsive to the needs of the detail industry the detailers have to speak up and tell them what they want and need. If you do not join you can't speak.
As it is, the ICA has a great amount of how to run a business information that a detailer could use. But, most are not looking for that, only how to detail.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 20, 2004 12:55PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 02:27AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>Bud & Scott,
You're taking this the wrong way. I'd like something started for just detailers -- not detailers, carwashers and lube shops. Please don't take my postings as negative...just trying to better ourselves and our businesses. And yes, there is always room for improvement in operating a detail business -- I learn something new everyday. I'm am not arguing or doubting that the ICA is helpful to detailers -- it just seems that carwashers are favored more since they're multi-million dollar establishments and many of us are just "one man shows."
Since posting the PDA thread on this forum and Mobileworks' forum, I have received a great number of emails from detailers willing to join such an Association and would pay $200+ for just detailers. And like me, they have run into the exact same problems and roadblocks.
But in the end, I respect all opinions regarding this matter.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
You're taking this the wrong way. I'd like something started for just detailers -- not detailers, carwashers and lube shops. Please don't take my postings as negative...just trying to better ourselves and our businesses. And yes, there is always room for improvement in operating a detail business -- I learn something new everyday. I'm am not arguing or doubting that the ICA is helpful to detailers -- it just seems that carwashers are favored more since they're multi-million dollar establishments and many of us are just "one man shows."
Since posting the PDA thread on this forum and Mobileworks' forum, I have received a great number of emails from detailers willing to join such an Association and would pay $200+ for just detailers. And like me, they have run into the exact same problems and roadblocks.
But in the end, I respect all opinions regarding this matter.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 04:16AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 751 |
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 06:25AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 201 |
<HTML>Scott,
After thinking about it, I believe I paid for it...around $65 or so? It was a good-sized binder with tabs on marketing (had lots of ad ideas), I think Bud's detail shop ads were in there!
When I sold my equip a few years ago, I gave the buyer the binder. Sorry I don't remember more about it.
R Regan</HTML>
After thinking about it, I believe I paid for it...around $65 or so? It was a good-sized binder with tabs on marketing (had lots of ad ideas), I think Bud's detail shop ads were in there!
When I sold my equip a few years ago, I gave the buyer the binder. Sorry I don't remember more about it.
R Regan</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 09:46AM |
<HTML>Who is being 'idealistic'?
We have already had a 'realistic' detailing association that existed for one purpose, 'to help detailers become more professional technically and in operating their businesses'.
What happened to that association?
Why did it fail?
How will doing it the same way twice change the outcome?
Have we learned nothing from our mistakes?</HTML>
We have already had a 'realistic' detailing association that existed for one purpose, 'to help detailers become more professional technically and in operating their businesses'.
What happened to that association?
Why did it fail?
How will doing it the same way twice change the outcome?
Have we learned nothing from our mistakes?</HTML>
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 02:05PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Frank:
The first PDA did not fail. We were doing very well after 5 years and a lot of hard work and effort on many people's part.
What we did was merger with the ICA and that was the mistake. Certain people had personal agenda's on the Board and when the merger took place they put their personal agenda's ahead of the association.
Few detailers then, as today, joined the ICA and as a result their attitide was that detailers did not want an association so they do not offer detailers much.
As I said to Frank we have in place a well established association with money and a large worldwide trade show. All the detail industry has to do is show support for that association and they will go out of their way to help the industry.
What some fail to realize is that over 85% of the carwashes offer detailing and could use the help of professional detailers to get better.
Think of this! How many mobile detailers who do not want to pay the overhead of a fixed location would love to have a detailing business in an existing carwash with all those customers? And, how many carwash operators who know nothing about detailing would love to have a detail operation on premises that they did not have to worry about and would generate some income?
There are many good possibilities for detailers to join and support ICA>
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
The first PDA did not fail. We were doing very well after 5 years and a lot of hard work and effort on many people's part.
What we did was merger with the ICA and that was the mistake. Certain people had personal agenda's on the Board and when the merger took place they put their personal agenda's ahead of the association.
Few detailers then, as today, joined the ICA and as a result their attitide was that detailers did not want an association so they do not offer detailers much.
As I said to Frank we have in place a well established association with money and a large worldwide trade show. All the detail industry has to do is show support for that association and they will go out of their way to help the industry.
What some fail to realize is that over 85% of the carwashes offer detailing and could use the help of professional detailers to get better.
Think of this! How many mobile detailers who do not want to pay the overhead of a fixed location would love to have a detailing business in an existing carwash with all those customers? And, how many carwash operators who know nothing about detailing would love to have a detail operation on premises that they did not have to worry about and would generate some income?
There are many good possibilities for detailers to join and support ICA>
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Professional Detailing Association May 21, 2004 02:32PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
<HTML>I do believe that detailers need representation just as everyone else here does. How we accomplish that is the question. I feel it is unnecessary to start up an entirely new organization and have all the work and expense that comes with it when we already have one. Why not just actually get involved in the organization we have and MAKE IT BETTER? That just seems logical to me. I understand your points about the carwash/lube segments of the market being better represented but you have to ask yourself why that is. I already spoke of how few detailers made the trip to the world car care expo this year - the place was packed with carwash and lube owners. Who do you think is going to be heard by the manufacturers/government/distributors/suppliers etc.. and most of all the ICA? This is just another example of how half assed our segment of the industry is with respect to being professional. I would wager that most of the guys that have pledged their $200 towards a new organization will not step up if you actually do it. These are the same guys who - don't have time to go the world car care expo because the are too busy - wold rather spend the money on family vacations etc...
Until detailers get serious about the BUSINESS of detailing we'll get no respect from anyone regardless of whether there is a new association or not.</HTML>
Until detailers get serious about the BUSINESS of detailing we'll get no respect from anyone regardless of whether there is a new association or not.</HTML>
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