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Car wash information
Posted by Rod W.
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Re: Car wash information September 07, 2004 01:39PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1 |
<HTML>This thread has generated a lot of responses, and obviously this is a controversial topic.
My opinion is that you are gambling when you hand over your car to another party to be washed. Whether it be a hand wash or the most advanced brushless system, you are still putting your trust in someone else to care for your paint.
That being said, I own a 7 year old car that has more luster and shine than a brand new car right out of the showroom. There are no swirl marks or spider web sratches. This only happens when car is taken to never use a contaminated rag on the car.
I use a car wash (automatic, hi-tech, professionally operated) between detailings. Luckily, the car wash I use has very high quality standards. There are a lot of discussions about teh type of brushes used in various car wash systems. That is important, but even more important is how the car is dried.
Typically, there is a crew of people that wipe the car dry after it comes out of the automatic wash. Before you use a car wash, sit and watch for 15 or 20 minutes. Look for these signs:
-- Are the rags clean, and 100% cotton?
-- Do they change rags frequently?
-- If they drop a rag, do they put it in the dirty bin and get a new one?
-- Do they use seperate rags to apply tire dressing, versus wiping the paint?
-- Do they lightly wipe the car, or do they apply pressure?
In my experience, these things are far more critical than the specifics of the automated washing system.
In addition, just about any automated system will apply a wax or polymer. If you can, have them skip that. It makes no sense to apply that cheap stuff over the top of your perfectly cleaned, polished, and waxed paint.
Even better, take a spray bottle of your favorite "quick detail" (Mother's or Meguiars are my fav's) and spray it over the car after it comes out of the wash and before they lay a rag on it. It takes about 2 minutes for you to mist the car, and the quick detail mist will act as a lubricant to prevent scratching as they wipe it down, and bring out the wax shine at the same time.
If you can't get them to allow you to do this, then just ak them not to dry it and do it yourself. Or if you trust that they use best practices to prevent scratching, let them do their job and then follow-up with a quick detail spray yourself.
I learned the hard way about picking just any car wash. There is nothing worse than paying $20 for a car wash, and then having to spend a day removing swirl marks and restoring your wax finish.
None of this is specific to the car wash being and automatic machine, or a hand wash. Either way, someone has to dry the car and the risk of ruining the paint detail exists. If I cannot find a car wash that I trust, I pay only to run it through the machine and then I dry it myself. If I can't find a machine that I trust, I find a coin operated do-it-yourself high pressure and go to town on it myself.</HTML>
My opinion is that you are gambling when you hand over your car to another party to be washed. Whether it be a hand wash or the most advanced brushless system, you are still putting your trust in someone else to care for your paint.
That being said, I own a 7 year old car that has more luster and shine than a brand new car right out of the showroom. There are no swirl marks or spider web sratches. This only happens when car is taken to never use a contaminated rag on the car.
I use a car wash (automatic, hi-tech, professionally operated) between detailings. Luckily, the car wash I use has very high quality standards. There are a lot of discussions about teh type of brushes used in various car wash systems. That is important, but even more important is how the car is dried.
Typically, there is a crew of people that wipe the car dry after it comes out of the automatic wash. Before you use a car wash, sit and watch for 15 or 20 minutes. Look for these signs:
-- Are the rags clean, and 100% cotton?
-- Do they change rags frequently?
-- If they drop a rag, do they put it in the dirty bin and get a new one?
-- Do they use seperate rags to apply tire dressing, versus wiping the paint?
-- Do they lightly wipe the car, or do they apply pressure?
In my experience, these things are far more critical than the specifics of the automated washing system.
In addition, just about any automated system will apply a wax or polymer. If you can, have them skip that. It makes no sense to apply that cheap stuff over the top of your perfectly cleaned, polished, and waxed paint.
Even better, take a spray bottle of your favorite "quick detail" (Mother's or Meguiars are my fav's) and spray it over the car after it comes out of the wash and before they lay a rag on it. It takes about 2 minutes for you to mist the car, and the quick detail mist will act as a lubricant to prevent scratching as they wipe it down, and bring out the wax shine at the same time.
If you can't get them to allow you to do this, then just ak them not to dry it and do it yourself. Or if you trust that they use best practices to prevent scratching, let them do their job and then follow-up with a quick detail spray yourself.
I learned the hard way about picking just any car wash. There is nothing worse than paying $20 for a car wash, and then having to spend a day removing swirl marks and restoring your wax finish.
None of this is specific to the car wash being and automatic machine, or a hand wash. Either way, someone has to dry the car and the risk of ruining the paint detail exists. If I cannot find a car wash that I trust, I pay only to run it through the machine and then I dry it myself. If I can't find a machine that I trust, I find a coin operated do-it-yourself high pressure and go to town on it myself.</HTML>
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Here we go again... April 23, 2005 10:21AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 2 |
<HTML>Hi all,
I've been lurking around this forum for a month now and just decided to register and chime in on this topic. I've seen various automatic car wash websites with the same study by certain University of Munich and, or University of Texas stating that hand wash causes more damage to the finish. I find the claims of the study quite interesting. Is there any information available regarding the actual study? Either by the univ in Munich or the university in Texas?
I have taken my cars to quite a few differet commercial automatic washes (touchless mostly) in search of the best alternative in hand washing it myself. I don't find the touchless washing process damaging itself. However, I do notice that automatic washes aren't always capable of removing dirt on the finish. The excess dirt left from the wash process is then wiped off in the drying process by the workers, causing swirl marks.
I agree that just because a vehicle is hand washed it doesnt mean it will be in better condition than one that is cleaned by automatic washes. I do believe that if both vehicles were cleaned by professionals, the hand wash vehicle would ultimately be in better condition, simply due to the fact that the machine cannot pay attention to each individual car like a professional detailer can.
I'm curious to know in the studies brought up by Bud, there were 2 cars, 1 was washed by a professional automatic car wash equipment, the other by hand, was the car subjected to hand wash, washed by a professional or just some students at the two universities conducting the research?
I agreed that a "well-maintained and operated, professional, conveyorized carwash" will not cause the type of nightmare stated by some on the forum, but automatic car washes focus on volume, speed, and efficiency. At the rate of 350-450 cars a day, automatic car washes cannot possibly wash each individual car with the attention needed to minimize damage to the finish. There just are too many variable contributing to the amout of possible damage induce by an automatic car wash. The machine maintainance, water pressure, chemical distribution, wash method (touchless, soft cloth, brush, foam, etc.), and final manual wipe down process by workers.
In the other hand, professional detailers have the ability to single handed control all the different variable potentially damaging to the finish in the hand wash process. They will be able to ensure the car is completely cleaned before moving ahead to drying, they will be able to make sure their wash-mitt is cleaned out before and during the hand wash. I highly doubt a automatic wash operator is able to constantly inspect the quality of his equipment while it's tunnel is moving 60 cars per hour.
I'm not out to bash on automatic washes, unless you are diagnosed with OCD chances are you will not be able to keep your car swirl free, hand wash or machine wash. But for the International Carwash Association to claim that hand washes in general to be "extremely harmful" and producing scratches that penetrate "as deep as 1/10th of the total thickness of the automobile's paint" is absolutely absurd. If I go by that theory, my paint could potentially be gone by the 10th time I hand wash my car. I have hand washed most of my cars 3 to 4 times more than that and I have yet to notice any sort of the stated severe damage to my paint.
Unlike most on this board, I'm not a professional detailer nor do I own a detail shop, and I happen to use automatic washes in conjunction with hand washing myself. I'm just appalled that the ICA would sponser such a test and allow the auto wash community to advertise this kind of misinformation to the geneal public. It is a shameless plug for the commercial automatic wash industry and very deceitful. Any educated person with minimal experiance in maintaining cars will be able to spot that the claims by the study aren't substantial and are biased. As one of those people I feel that it is an insult to my intelligence. Why couldn't the ICA bank on the fact that commercial automatic car washes recycle or filter their waste water, therefore are much more environmental friendly than normal hand washes?
Bud, I have read your posts across all the main auto care related forums and not only do I respect your knowledge in the field, I've learned a lot from your posts and articles. My post is not meant to be a personal attack by any means. From my understanding you have been elected to the ICA Board of Directers for the next three years, this post is just a feedback regarding this issue from a weekend detailer/consumer of the automatic car wash service.
Sorry for opening this can of worms again...</HTML>
I've been lurking around this forum for a month now and just decided to register and chime in on this topic. I've seen various automatic car wash websites with the same study by certain University of Munich and, or University of Texas stating that hand wash causes more damage to the finish. I find the claims of the study quite interesting. Is there any information available regarding the actual study? Either by the univ in Munich or the university in Texas?
I have taken my cars to quite a few differet commercial automatic washes (touchless mostly) in search of the best alternative in hand washing it myself. I don't find the touchless washing process damaging itself. However, I do notice that automatic washes aren't always capable of removing dirt on the finish. The excess dirt left from the wash process is then wiped off in the drying process by the workers, causing swirl marks.
I agree that just because a vehicle is hand washed it doesnt mean it will be in better condition than one that is cleaned by automatic washes. I do believe that if both vehicles were cleaned by professionals, the hand wash vehicle would ultimately be in better condition, simply due to the fact that the machine cannot pay attention to each individual car like a professional detailer can.
I'm curious to know in the studies brought up by Bud, there were 2 cars, 1 was washed by a professional automatic car wash equipment, the other by hand, was the car subjected to hand wash, washed by a professional or just some students at the two universities conducting the research?
I agreed that a "well-maintained and operated, professional, conveyorized carwash" will not cause the type of nightmare stated by some on the forum, but automatic car washes focus on volume, speed, and efficiency. At the rate of 350-450 cars a day, automatic car washes cannot possibly wash each individual car with the attention needed to minimize damage to the finish. There just are too many variable contributing to the amout of possible damage induce by an automatic car wash. The machine maintainance, water pressure, chemical distribution, wash method (touchless, soft cloth, brush, foam, etc.), and final manual wipe down process by workers.
In the other hand, professional detailers have the ability to single handed control all the different variable potentially damaging to the finish in the hand wash process. They will be able to ensure the car is completely cleaned before moving ahead to drying, they will be able to make sure their wash-mitt is cleaned out before and during the hand wash. I highly doubt a automatic wash operator is able to constantly inspect the quality of his equipment while it's tunnel is moving 60 cars per hour.
I'm not out to bash on automatic washes, unless you are diagnosed with OCD chances are you will not be able to keep your car swirl free, hand wash or machine wash. But for the International Carwash Association to claim that hand washes in general to be "extremely harmful" and producing scratches that penetrate "as deep as 1/10th of the total thickness of the automobile's paint" is absolutely absurd. If I go by that theory, my paint could potentially be gone by the 10th time I hand wash my car. I have hand washed most of my cars 3 to 4 times more than that and I have yet to notice any sort of the stated severe damage to my paint.
Unlike most on this board, I'm not a professional detailer nor do I own a detail shop, and I happen to use automatic washes in conjunction with hand washing myself. I'm just appalled that the ICA would sponser such a test and allow the auto wash community to advertise this kind of misinformation to the geneal public. It is a shameless plug for the commercial automatic wash industry and very deceitful. Any educated person with minimal experiance in maintaining cars will be able to spot that the claims by the study aren't substantial and are biased. As one of those people I feel that it is an insult to my intelligence. Why couldn't the ICA bank on the fact that commercial automatic car washes recycle or filter their waste water, therefore are much more environmental friendly than normal hand washes?
Bud, I have read your posts across all the main auto care related forums and not only do I respect your knowledge in the field, I've learned a lot from your posts and articles. My post is not meant to be a personal attack by any means. From my understanding you have been elected to the ICA Board of Directers for the next three years, this post is just a feedback regarding this issue from a weekend detailer/consumer of the automatic car wash service.
Sorry for opening this can of worms again...</HTML>
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Re: Here we go again... April 23, 2005 12:13PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>If you are interested in having a copy of the summary of the Technological University of Munich's study please contact me directl and I will send it to you.
By the way, touchless washing may seem to be safe, but consider two things:
1. Many of the auto manufacturers in their owner's manuals tell the motorist not to wash the car with acids or high alkaline chemicals nor high pressure water. These are both key components of touchless washing.
2. If a chemical wash process will remove dirt and "oily" road film, won't it also remove "oily" wax? Of course it will. That is right any wax protection you have on the paint is "striped" off in a touchless wash process.
Further, most everyone in the carwash industry admits that if the car is really dirty it takes some prepping with a brush or mitt before the wash to get it clean. This brush or mitt against the car's paint will scratch it, plus it is no longer touchless is it?
The report clearly explains why how a hand wash process can be safe, but it is most difficult to do when hand washing.
Regards
Bud Abraham
DETAIL PLUS SYSTEMS</HTML>
buda
By the way, touchless washing may seem to be safe, but consider two things:
1. Many of the auto manufacturers in their owner's manuals tell the motorist not to wash the car with acids or high alkaline chemicals nor high pressure water. These are both key components of touchless washing.
2. If a chemical wash process will remove dirt and "oily" road film, won't it also remove "oily" wax? Of course it will. That is right any wax protection you have on the paint is "striped" off in a touchless wash process.
Further, most everyone in the carwash industry admits that if the car is really dirty it takes some prepping with a brush or mitt before the wash to get it clean. This brush or mitt against the car's paint will scratch it, plus it is no longer touchless is it?
The report clearly explains why how a hand wash process can be safe, but it is most difficult to do when hand washing.
Regards
Bud Abraham
DETAIL PLUS SYSTEMS</HTML>
buda
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Re: Here we go again... April 23, 2005 03:36PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
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Re: Here we go again... April 24, 2005 02:10PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 201 |
<HTML>Lets face it , it all depends on how well the car wash takes care of their equipment. The bigger car washes take better care than the smaller ones. In my area that would be Turtle Wax,Fullers and Delta Sonic. Ive seen cars done at these places , and years later they still look good . Ive also seen cars done at other places and even the glass was scratched. So automatic car washes are good if you pick the right one.</HTML>
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Re: Here we go again... April 25, 2005 02:46PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 894 |
<HTML>Bud,
After 26 washings I dont believe that the caustics in the soap they use will show true damage yet. It takes about 6 months to 1 year to see failing clear coat after using an automatic car wash. I have first hand experience because my friend used to take her car to one at a gas station, it didnt take very long for the paint system to fail.
They should do a year long test, because its the long term affect that matters. Let see what finish looks better after that length of time!!
Dan Draper
DRAPERSAUTOIMAGERY.COM</HTML>
After 26 washings I dont believe that the caustics in the soap they use will show true damage yet. It takes about 6 months to 1 year to see failing clear coat after using an automatic car wash. I have first hand experience because my friend used to take her car to one at a gas station, it didnt take very long for the paint system to fail.
They should do a year long test, because its the long term affect that matters. Let see what finish looks better after that length of time!!
Dan Draper
DRAPERSAUTOIMAGERY.COM</HTML>
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Re: Here we go again... April 25, 2005 03:45PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Dan:
You are totally misinformed when you say the shampoos that are used in carwashes are full of caustics. That is totally inaccurate. The shampoos used in automatic soft cloth or foam washes are probably less aggressive than some of the chemicals that hand washers used on cars.
The way you use the term caustic it sounds as though you are talking about a caustic like sodium hydroxide that is used in an engine degreaser. While some detailer, in fact, do use engine degreaser diluted down to wash a car, the carwash shampoos do not contain sodium hydroxide nor any caustic anywhere near the pH levels of an engine degreaser.
That said, the point of the study done was to determine which method resulted in more scratches and dulling due to washing materials.
TOUCHLESS WASHING
I would agree that the touchless washing process, which is used mainly by gas stations and self service carwashes who put in an inbay automatic has a harmful long-range effect on the paint. This is due to the acids and higher pH chemicals used in the process.
However, friction washes using cloth or foam, which by the way, were not the washing materials used in the University of Munich test, do not use such chemicals.
Regards
BUd Abraham</HTML>
buda
You are totally misinformed when you say the shampoos that are used in carwashes are full of caustics. That is totally inaccurate. The shampoos used in automatic soft cloth or foam washes are probably less aggressive than some of the chemicals that hand washers used on cars.
The way you use the term caustic it sounds as though you are talking about a caustic like sodium hydroxide that is used in an engine degreaser. While some detailer, in fact, do use engine degreaser diluted down to wash a car, the carwash shampoos do not contain sodium hydroxide nor any caustic anywhere near the pH levels of an engine degreaser.
That said, the point of the study done was to determine which method resulted in more scratches and dulling due to washing materials.
TOUCHLESS WASHING
I would agree that the touchless washing process, which is used mainly by gas stations and self service carwashes who put in an inbay automatic has a harmful long-range effect on the paint. This is due to the acids and higher pH chemicals used in the process.
However, friction washes using cloth or foam, which by the way, were not the washing materials used in the University of Munich test, do not use such chemicals.
Regards
BUd Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Here we go again... April 26, 2005 01:56AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 4 |
<HTML>I would like to get a copy of this test. Because there is obviously a lot of info in this test that i would like to read, such as how they hand washed the vehicle, type of pad or sponge that was used, how many times the bucket water was replaced. Was the vehicle driven around then washed or were the washes done one rite after the other. The type of car wash system that was used. Were these experts or students. All these play a big part in determing the results. Being a student also. We do a lot of studys and test in areas that we are not experts in. At least not yet that is.
Through my personal experience in the profession and as well as a customer. car wash systems had done extensive damage to my vehicle. Not to say that some hand washing services didnt either. And most of this also comes from the knowledge of the owner. there is unfortunaly, owners that dont care bout anything other then making money. Most of there systems have never or very seldomly been maintained. Then there is auto detail owners who hand wash, but use the same wash bucket water on a well maintained not too dirty vehicle, that they just used to wash a truck that came back from a 3 day off roading trip.
I use the two bucket system. One with regular clean water, and one with shampoo. After my wash mit leaves the vehicle, I dip it in the clean water then back in the shampoo. then disgard both buckets of water and replace with clean water and shampoo after every wash.
So there is always a pro and con to every method. Its just which works for you and how you perform the method. im getting ready to open a car wash/detail shop. There is a system that i saw in Tucson Az, that Im going to use in my shop. It incorperated both systems in their car wash. The vehicle entered the tunnel it was rinsed off the machine, then four employees hand washed the vehicle. Then it was rinsed again by the machine, then entered blowers to remove excess water then was hand dryed by four more employees. I had the honor of working for them, before i decided to go mobile.</HTML>
Chris Garcia
Sunset Mobile Wash
El Paso, Tx
(915)256-7456
Through my personal experience in the profession and as well as a customer. car wash systems had done extensive damage to my vehicle. Not to say that some hand washing services didnt either. And most of this also comes from the knowledge of the owner. there is unfortunaly, owners that dont care bout anything other then making money. Most of there systems have never or very seldomly been maintained. Then there is auto detail owners who hand wash, but use the same wash bucket water on a well maintained not too dirty vehicle, that they just used to wash a truck that came back from a 3 day off roading trip.
I use the two bucket system. One with regular clean water, and one with shampoo. After my wash mit leaves the vehicle, I dip it in the clean water then back in the shampoo. then disgard both buckets of water and replace with clean water and shampoo after every wash.
So there is always a pro and con to every method. Its just which works for you and how you perform the method. im getting ready to open a car wash/detail shop. There is a system that i saw in Tucson Az, that Im going to use in my shop. It incorperated both systems in their car wash. The vehicle entered the tunnel it was rinsed off the machine, then four employees hand washed the vehicle. Then it was rinsed again by the machine, then entered blowers to remove excess water then was hand dryed by four more employees. I had the honor of working for them, before i decided to go mobile.</HTML>
Chris Garcia
Sunset Mobile Wash
El Paso, Tx
(915)256-7456
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Re: Here we go again... April 27, 2005 11:12AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 2 |
<HTML>Bud,
Do you happen to have a copy of the test by University of Texas at Arlington SANCTIONED by the International Carwash Association? That is the one that I'm most interested in. Do you think you can post it on the forum so we can settle this once and for all? Is the study done by the University of Munich done in English or German? If it's done in German then is there a translated version, if so, by who? Thanks!</HTML>
Do you happen to have a copy of the test by University of Texas at Arlington SANCTIONED by the International Carwash Association? That is the one that I'm most interested in. Do you think you can post it on the forum so we can settle this once and for all? Is the study done by the University of Munich done in English or German? If it's done in German then is there a translated version, if so, by who? Thanks!</HTML>
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Re: Here we go again... April 27, 2005 01:46PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>If you go to www.kaadycarwashes.com you will find it on that website under Handwashing vs Machine Washing. It is the full report done by the University of Texas.
The Technological Unversity of Munich's report, done for MB is in English, but I have not seen a copy of it in a long time. Lost the one I had. You might find it if you go to the websites of some of the carwash chains:
Jax Carwashes in Michigan
Auto Magic Car Washes in Missouri
Mike's Car Washes in Indiana
Scrub a Dub in Mass.
Auto Bell Carwashes in NC
Delta Sonic
White Glove
Mr Wash
These are all large carwash chains that might have the German report on their sites.
Let me know if you find it there.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
The Technological Unversity of Munich's report, done for MB is in English, but I have not seen a copy of it in a long time. Lost the one I had. You might find it if you go to the websites of some of the carwash chains:
Jax Carwashes in Michigan
Auto Magic Car Washes in Missouri
Mike's Car Washes in Indiana
Scrub a Dub in Mass.
Auto Bell Carwashes in NC
Delta Sonic
White Glove
Mr Wash
These are all large carwash chains that might have the German report on their sites.
Let me know if you find it there.
Regards
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Here we go again... April 28, 2005 12:16AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 39 |
<HTML>I just detailed a brand new Lexus w 6k on the odometer because the owner took his car through an automatic car wash. The vehicle had deep scratches from the front of the hood to the end of the trunk.
His $10 mistake earned me 15x that amount.
I LOVE AUTOMATIC CARWASHES!
Christian</HTML>
His $10 mistake earned me 15x that amount.
I LOVE AUTOMATIC CARWASHES!
Christian</HTML>
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Re: Here we go again... April 28, 2005 02:08AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>Christian:
Let's set the record straight. Was this a conveyorized professional automatic carwash or one of those roll-overs in a gas station or a self service carwash.
While these are automatic systems, they do not represent the hard working, professional carwash operators who invest huge amounts of money in top quality equipment and expensive shampoos to insure their wash equipment does not damage cars.
You and others on the board need to clarify what they mean by automatic carwashes that cause damage.
Yes, I know there are some conveyor system operators who do not do a good job of maintaining their equipment, JUST like the majority of detailers who put swirls in the paint because they do not know how to detail.
Just had my training director tell me about a detailer 55 years old who has been detailing all his life tell him he never uses a buffer, ever. That he knows how to wetsand, etc. My trainer said how can you wet sand and then take out the scratches by hand? So many guys like this in the detail business. So we had better be careful about calling the kettle black.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
Let's set the record straight. Was this a conveyorized professional automatic carwash or one of those roll-overs in a gas station or a self service carwash.
While these are automatic systems, they do not represent the hard working, professional carwash operators who invest huge amounts of money in top quality equipment and expensive shampoos to insure their wash equipment does not damage cars.
You and others on the board need to clarify what they mean by automatic carwashes that cause damage.
Yes, I know there are some conveyor system operators who do not do a good job of maintaining their equipment, JUST like the majority of detailers who put swirls in the paint because they do not know how to detail.
Just had my training director tell me about a detailer 55 years old who has been detailing all his life tell him he never uses a buffer, ever. That he knows how to wetsand, etc. My trainer said how can you wet sand and then take out the scratches by hand? So many guys like this in the detail business. So we had better be careful about calling the kettle black.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: Here we go again... May 12, 2005 06:28PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1 |
<HTML>Hello everyone,
Like some of you, I have been following the thread of this message since sept last year.
I want to thank everyone who posted for alot of good info. If I may, I would like to add my thoughts on the subject.
I think we all agree that no matter how a car is cleaned, Damage to the paint is inevitable, mostly the talk has been to what degree we all are willing to accept. Hand wash, cloth/brush, brushless/high pressure and soaps. I have lived from conneticut to hawaii, from alaska to florida. and several states inbetween. I am in my mid forties so I have been cleaning vehicles for near 35 years (thanks dad) Not as long as some, more then others. And while it is important to not add more damage to one vehicle unnecessarily, eventually damage will accure. I guess it all comes down to what each individual can and will accept. I feel that I am just an average person. I cannot come close to comparing my knowledge to most of you who post here. When I look at my truck of 5 years, bought new at dealer, I do not see swirls in paint, spider webs or scratches caused by washing. What I see is damage done by the road. Scratches made by kids running their hands on it while at a shopping mall. Chips from rocks thrown up by other vehicles. Dents made by deer when they ran into the side.
I have washed my vehicles by hand, being very meticulous to keep my water, soap, and cloths clean so as not to scratch the paint. I have used cloth automatic, touchless and professional detailers. All with mixed results.
So what is the bottom line???
Everyone must answer that themselves. I plan on using the info I have learned from all everytime I clean my vehicles from now on.
Having said all that, I have a request for all. I am looking into starting an automated car wash in my area. Ergo me reading anything and everything on this subject about washing cars. Most of the people around here are average people like me. They just want a clean car with the least amount of damage as possible. ANY help would be appreciated in this area.
Thanks</HTML>
GreyHawk
Live, Love, Laugh
Life is too short not to
Like some of you, I have been following the thread of this message since sept last year.
I want to thank everyone who posted for alot of good info. If I may, I would like to add my thoughts on the subject.
I think we all agree that no matter how a car is cleaned, Damage to the paint is inevitable, mostly the talk has been to what degree we all are willing to accept. Hand wash, cloth/brush, brushless/high pressure and soaps. I have lived from conneticut to hawaii, from alaska to florida. and several states inbetween. I am in my mid forties so I have been cleaning vehicles for near 35 years (thanks dad) Not as long as some, more then others. And while it is important to not add more damage to one vehicle unnecessarily, eventually damage will accure. I guess it all comes down to what each individual can and will accept. I feel that I am just an average person. I cannot come close to comparing my knowledge to most of you who post here. When I look at my truck of 5 years, bought new at dealer, I do not see swirls in paint, spider webs or scratches caused by washing. What I see is damage done by the road. Scratches made by kids running their hands on it while at a shopping mall. Chips from rocks thrown up by other vehicles. Dents made by deer when they ran into the side.
I have washed my vehicles by hand, being very meticulous to keep my water, soap, and cloths clean so as not to scratch the paint. I have used cloth automatic, touchless and professional detailers. All with mixed results.
So what is the bottom line???
Everyone must answer that themselves. I plan on using the info I have learned from all everytime I clean my vehicles from now on.
Having said all that, I have a request for all. I am looking into starting an automated car wash in my area. Ergo me reading anything and everything on this subject about washing cars. Most of the people around here are average people like me. They just want a clean car with the least amount of damage as possible. ANY help would be appreciated in this area.
Thanks</HTML>
GreyHawk
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