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Email to MB Dealer
Posted by Brian Angelucci
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Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 04:21AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>Here's an email I just wrote to a MB dealership where one of my customers just bought his car:
Recently I detailed one of your customers 2003 MB CLK 320 and was surprised to notice swirl marks all over the hood. Could you mention to your detail/prep department there is no need to use a rotary buffer on these high-line, like new cars? Or if a rotary was used for minor scratch/defect removal, that they need to use a swirl remover as a follow up. I'm not complaining, just informing to ensure a delivery with a flawless presentation.
Sincerely,
Brian Angelucci
Precision Auto & Marine
Does that sound snobby or professional?</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
Recently I detailed one of your customers 2003 MB CLK 320 and was surprised to notice swirl marks all over the hood. Could you mention to your detail/prep department there is no need to use a rotary buffer on these high-line, like new cars? Or if a rotary was used for minor scratch/defect removal, that they need to use a swirl remover as a follow up. I'm not complaining, just informing to ensure a delivery with a flawless presentation.
Sincerely,
Brian Angelucci
Precision Auto & Marine
Does that sound snobby or professional?</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 04:32AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 107 |
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 05:03AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 866 |
<HTML>Hey MAN !! KICK BACK!!
You should of said - I found swils and buffer marks on a new car from your dealership-NICE JOB, KEEP'EM COMMING!
Your truly,
easy money
<img src=http://www.superiorshine.com/Mobile_Auto_Detailing_Covina.JPG>
.</HTML>
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Plays in the rain --- www.SuperiorShineDetailing.com
You should of said - I found swils and buffer marks on a new car from your dealership-NICE JOB, KEEP'EM COMMING!
Your truly,
easy money
<img src=http://www.superiorshine.com/Mobile_Auto_Detailing_Covina.JPG>
.</HTML>
-----------------------------------------------------
Plays in the rain --- www.SuperiorShineDetailing.com
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 11:26AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
<HTML>Unfortunately I fear your e-mail will be over the head of the mentality of most guys at the dealership. If you really want to pursue this line of work might I suggest that that you take some pictures illustrating what the problem was, another picture of the finish after correction and a letter from the customer praising your work. Go see the dealer principle or General Manager if they will see you - these are the guys who make the real decisions at the dealership. If you can win them over you are set. Most of the other managers at the dealerships love to bully and low-ball detailers to try and maintain high margins so I would avoid them altogether until you have the big shots on your side. I am actually going up to my biggest dealers 5 million dollar "cottage" this weekend again because I have become such good friends with one of the sons through the course of doing business. I would not send the e-mail though - too impersonal. Try going to see them in person and dress nice! Not a suit but a nice pair of khakis and a nice golf shirt will tell them you aren't the average hacker they typically are used to calling on them.
I have actually gotten myself into the position of "expert" with my Nissan/Infiniti dealer now by doing this. They refuse to send all their work to me but I regularly fix thier shops screw ups for big bucks and they send me all kinds of high end referrals now too. Give it a try and let me know how it works out. Good luck.</HTML>
I have actually gotten myself into the position of "expert" with my Nissan/Infiniti dealer now by doing this. They refuse to send all their work to me but I regularly fix thier shops screw ups for big bucks and they send me all kinds of high end referrals now too. Give it a try and let me know how it works out. Good luck.</HTML>
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 02:40PM |
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 04:45PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>Scott,
I don't do business with the MB dealership directly but a lot of the customers who buy the cars from there come to me. I'd love to run an in-house detail shop at these Mercedes dealerships and do the work properly. Maybe someday I'll venture out there.
Especially today with the ceramic nano clearcoat, these untrained detailers are going to do more harm than good. IF these nano cars need to be corrected (highly unlikely) there is only one compound that is correct for buffing and do these detailers know that? Probably not.
Lupo, you are right, these NEW cars should never have a rotary put on their finishes.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
I don't do business with the MB dealership directly but a lot of the customers who buy the cars from there come to me. I'd love to run an in-house detail shop at these Mercedes dealerships and do the work properly. Maybe someday I'll venture out there.
Especially today with the ceramic nano clearcoat, these untrained detailers are going to do more harm than good. IF these nano cars need to be corrected (highly unlikely) there is only one compound that is correct for buffing and do these detailers know that? Probably not.
Lupo, you are right, these NEW cars should never have a rotary put on their finishes.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 08:58PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 499 |
<HTML>I had (but lost) the TSB on the new nano clears but seem to recall that it listed several different compounds that were suitable for use to correct imperfections. What is the specific compund you are referring to? I use a lot of the Autoglym compounds from England and seem to recall that they were approved as it is a bodyshop line. Let me know. I know Ketch also has his new "cerrious" polish as well.</HTML>
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 09:18PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
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Re: Email to MB Dealer July 03, 2004 09:19PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>The email did not go far enough. Your comments only sounded like your opinion.
What you need to do first is write a very professional letter to the OWNER of the dealership.
Then go into what you found on the car and why it happened.
Then explain what tools; pads and chemicals are available to do the job right.
And, that if his detailing dept does not have these tools, pads, chemicals etc they are not properly working on vehicles.
Offer to come in and train some of his staff in the particulars of modern paint finishes and what is needed to work on them.
Get the dealer's attention by saying that you work on a number of his customers cars and that you notice they have problems when they come to you due to lack of understanding on the part of his detailers.
This might even get you something good.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
What you need to do first is write a very professional letter to the OWNER of the dealership.
Then go into what you found on the car and why it happened.
Then explain what tools; pads and chemicals are available to do the job right.
And, that if his detailing dept does not have these tools, pads, chemicals etc they are not properly working on vehicles.
Offer to come in and train some of his staff in the particulars of modern paint finishes and what is needed to work on them.
Get the dealer's attention by saying that you work on a number of his customers cars and that you notice they have problems when they come to you due to lack of understanding on the part of his detailers.
This might even get you something good.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 03, 2004 10:04PM |
<HTML>I was told Menzerna polishes from Germany are favored for Mercedes paint and are the only polishes used on the Maybach. I also read good things about the Autoglym polishes. However, I read a scanned copy of a Mercedes bulletin on Cermaiclear online somewhere that indicated on the bottom Meguiars and 3m are ok for it. I suppose all the major manufacturers will come out with one or get their existing polishes approved for ceramic type paint</HTML>
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 04, 2004 04:48AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 866 |
<HTML>Brian, What was the reason for the letter to the MBZ dealer?
Did you think they would past your letter around and then completely change their ways?
Or you just wanted to rub their poor workmanship in their face?</HTML>
-----------------------------------------------------
Plays in the rain --- www.SuperiorShineDetailing.com
Did you think they would past your letter around and then completely change their ways?
Or you just wanted to rub their poor workmanship in their face?</HTML>
-----------------------------------------------------
Plays in the rain --- www.SuperiorShineDetailing.com
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 04, 2004 07:51AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 1,838 |
<HTML>Jose,
The reason for the letter was to let them know the results of their workmanship was poor and somewhat damaging. Don't mean damaging meaning there was damage done to the paint but swil marks all over the hood. So you, their poor workmanship was pretty much the reason. Hopefully they will change their ways -- and like Bud says, maybe I can get in there and train them to do it properly.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
The reason for the letter was to let them know the results of their workmanship was poor and somewhat damaging. Don't mean damaging meaning there was damage done to the paint but swil marks all over the hood. So you, their poor workmanship was pretty much the reason. Hopefully they will change their ways -- and like Bud says, maybe I can get in there and train them to do it properly.</HTML>
Take care,
Brian
Precision Auto & Marine
Learn to detail boats! Visit www.detailtheboat.com
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 04, 2004 04:29PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 866 |
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 04, 2004 07:31PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 382 |
<HTML>That's very interesting, Brian!! Follow Bud's & Scotty's advice and it could be an "in" to the MB dealerships.
One thing I learned in talking to a detailer who used to work at an MB delership was that just because they sell & service MB, doesn't mean that they don't behave like what they are....auto dealers!!! He told me that at the dealership where he worked, they hired inexperienced high school & college students to "detail" the cars. They paid the detailers $6-7/hour and used the cheapest products on the market. Most of their details consisted of washing, vacuuming, and application of a wax or sealant by hand or with a polisher. Nothing too complicated and they charged the customers $199 for a "full" detail. They subletted the cars that needed more attention to a detail shop in town & paid wholesale prices for the work.
So, keep in mind, fellow detailers, that just because the dealership is high-end, it doesn't mean that they won't cut costs where they can and overcharge the unsuspecting customer to make a tidy profit. There's a market to be had out there simply by doing a better job than most dealerships are capable of. That's not to say that some dealership's don't have outstanding detailing departments, but at this time, most don't. Simply because they're trying to do production detailing as quickly and cheaply as possible which produces less than stellar results.</HTML>
Shine On!
Rod Wesley
Touch Up 'N' Go!
Auto & Marine Appearance Center
We take your car from Rough to Buff!
Visit our website at: www.touchupngo.com
One thing I learned in talking to a detailer who used to work at an MB delership was that just because they sell & service MB, doesn't mean that they don't behave like what they are....auto dealers!!! He told me that at the dealership where he worked, they hired inexperienced high school & college students to "detail" the cars. They paid the detailers $6-7/hour and used the cheapest products on the market. Most of their details consisted of washing, vacuuming, and application of a wax or sealant by hand or with a polisher. Nothing too complicated and they charged the customers $199 for a "full" detail. They subletted the cars that needed more attention to a detail shop in town & paid wholesale prices for the work.
So, keep in mind, fellow detailers, that just because the dealership is high-end, it doesn't mean that they won't cut costs where they can and overcharge the unsuspecting customer to make a tidy profit. There's a market to be had out there simply by doing a better job than most dealerships are capable of. That's not to say that some dealership's don't have outstanding detailing departments, but at this time, most don't. Simply because they're trying to do production detailing as quickly and cheaply as possible which produces less than stellar results.</HTML>
Shine On!
Rod Wesley
Touch Up 'N' Go!
Auto & Marine Appearance Center
We take your car from Rough to Buff!
Visit our website at: www.touchupngo.com
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 05, 2004 01:54PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 4 |
<HTML>Speaking of Mercedes, I have been detailing quick a few high end imports lately: Mercedes, BMW, Porshe, Lexus. One of the car's owners asked me if manufacturers ever recommend particular brands of wax/polish products for their particular makes. Does anyone know if any of these companies recommend/endorse a specific brand for their automobilies?
Thanks,
Rachael</HTML>
Thanks,
Rachael</HTML>
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 05, 2004 04:58PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
<HTML>From what I know, most manufacturers recommend the products that they have private-labeled under their own name.
The thing you have to understand is that most paint is basically the same and most waxes or sealants are basicaly the same.
Some shine more than others; some are more durable than others and some are most resistent to corrosion than others. But they have many of the same components in them so what is used to provide protection does not make all that much difference. If they did, the manufacturers would void the paint warranty if other than their products were used.
Consider that the auto manufacturers do not demand that a certain brand of motor oil or transmission fluid, etc is used in the car. Why then would they demand that a certain wax or sealant be used, other than one they could make some money with.
Hope that helps.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
The thing you have to understand is that most paint is basically the same and most waxes or sealants are basicaly the same.
Some shine more than others; some are more durable than others and some are most resistent to corrosion than others. But they have many of the same components in them so what is used to provide protection does not make all that much difference. If they did, the manufacturers would void the paint warranty if other than their products were used.
Consider that the auto manufacturers do not demand that a certain brand of motor oil or transmission fluid, etc is used in the car. Why then would they demand that a certain wax or sealant be used, other than one they could make some money with.
Hope that helps.
Bud Abraham</HTML>
buda
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 06, 2004 03:19AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 27 |
<HTML>"Consider that the auto manufacturers do not demand that a certain brand of motor oil or transmission fluid, etc is used in the car. Why then would they demand that a certain wax or sealant be used"
_______________________________________________________
Because there are laws that help to stop things like that. They do RECOMEND certain brands of oil but dont REQUIRE it, I think the law says something to the effect of if the MFG requires a cunsumer to use only the mfg brand of part for a regular maintenance item ( or warantee will be void ) the mfg must supply it to the consumer at no charge.
I am not sure if I worded that correctly but I have it in a book somewhere, you dont think they would make you use their brand if they could get away with it ?</HTML>
_______________________________________________________
Because there are laws that help to stop things like that. They do RECOMEND certain brands of oil but dont REQUIRE it, I think the law says something to the effect of if the MFG requires a cunsumer to use only the mfg brand of part for a regular maintenance item ( or warantee will be void ) the mfg must supply it to the consumer at no charge.
I am not sure if I worded that correctly but I have it in a book somewhere, you dont think they would make you use their brand if they could get away with it ?</HTML>
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 06, 2004 04:04AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 751 |
<HTML>I know Ford have a complete line of detailing products for in house use, and they also have a big fancy Motocraft dispenser . That said I dont know how many dealers use them. Ford do stipulate the use of certain chemicals in their warranty program to dealers, for instance the ABC system for rail dust removal.
Saturn have their own line of retail products and actually give out leaflets to customers , it's not a huge range, a PH balanced car wash, caranauba wax, leather conditioner etc.
Jim.</HTML>
Saturn have their own line of retail products and actually give out leaflets to customers , it's not a huge range, a PH balanced car wash, caranauba wax, leather conditioner etc.
Jim.</HTML>
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 06, 2004 04:08AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 866 |
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 06, 2004 04:55AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 3,550 |
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 08, 2004 04:48AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 6 |
<HTML>having been in the industry for quite some time now I have had the previledge of working with some of the finest people in the indusrty and I have worked for a couple of chemical companies on the sales and manufacturing end of things.
I am quite certain that MFG's Like Dodge, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, and Honda all have their own lines of private labeled chemicals and Polishes that they do recommend to thier customers.
Some Dealerships can and do offer retail product lines such as Meguiar's for consumer use, because that is exactly who is going to buy that product. the consumer. nearly all dealerships/MFG's offer some type of Paint Protection Package that you can purchase when you buy your new car but remember that it comes from the MFG not the an aftermarket company unless the Protection system has been endorsed by the MFG.
as far as Ford's Warranty Program, and the use of certain MFG products, Ford, Chevy and many other dealerships often leave it up to the dealership to remove or offer protection under their own warranty programs... EG, Ford's warranty program is called the R-23 Warranty Program, and it stipulates that the dealer must under contract, prep the vehicle and or polish/wax the painted surfaces within 30-60 days of P.D.I.</HTML>
Dennis C. Whitnall
Industrial Automotive, Inc.
I am quite certain that MFG's Like Dodge, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, and Honda all have their own lines of private labeled chemicals and Polishes that they do recommend to thier customers.
Some Dealerships can and do offer retail product lines such as Meguiar's for consumer use, because that is exactly who is going to buy that product. the consumer. nearly all dealerships/MFG's offer some type of Paint Protection Package that you can purchase when you buy your new car but remember that it comes from the MFG not the an aftermarket company unless the Protection system has been endorsed by the MFG.
as far as Ford's Warranty Program, and the use of certain MFG products, Ford, Chevy and many other dealerships often leave it up to the dealership to remove or offer protection under their own warranty programs... EG, Ford's warranty program is called the R-23 Warranty Program, and it stipulates that the dealer must under contract, prep the vehicle and or polish/wax the painted surfaces within 30-60 days of P.D.I.</HTML>
Dennis C. Whitnall
Industrial Automotive, Inc.
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 08, 2004 06:28PM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 243 |
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 09, 2004 02:02AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 505 |
<HTML>Excuse me!!
The Mercedes paint, is actually PPG OEM material(worry not about what company you may have heard provides it, that company is owned by PPG), it nothing that was developed or produced by Mercedes Benz!
All their "assembly plants" do is apply the paint film, "notice-paint film, or total build of the paint surface."
It is a "sort of new" approach to an mature technology, and the "ceramic" part of the clear is only a "micro or two" thickeness created in the curing process versus the normal "Solex" clears that have been around for a couple of years.
Ketch</HTML>
Do it right or don't do it all!
The Mercedes paint, is actually PPG OEM material(worry not about what company you may have heard provides it, that company is owned by PPG), it nothing that was developed or produced by Mercedes Benz!
All their "assembly plants" do is apply the paint film, "notice-paint film, or total build of the paint surface."
It is a "sort of new" approach to an mature technology, and the "ceramic" part of the clear is only a "micro or two" thickeness created in the curing process versus the normal "Solex" clears that have been around for a couple of years.
Ketch</HTML>
Do it right or don't do it all!
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Re: PPG Ceraminclear compounds July 09, 2004 02:41AM |
Registered: 17 years ago Posts: 505 |
<HTML>Rachel,
Like has been stated, each has their "endorsements" of what or whatever.
All I can say, is we make "waxes/sealants" with the car companies name on them for Nissan, Renault, DaimlerChrysler, Saab, Saturn, AC/Delco, Ford, and a few others.
We also have the "recommendations" in Technical Service Bulletins, that the dealer or owner may chose to use not only our products, under our ValuGard name brand, but also Mequiar's and 3M.
Not to "knock" other brands, and some such as Eagle One, a divison of Ashland Chemical has VW and Audi's stamp of approval.
At present, Automotive International provides some products to 9 of the 15 largest vehicle manufacturers in the world.
As I said, that does not mean that other companies do not have good products, or even possibly, superior products, it just means that they do not have the finnancial or personel resourses, the time, etc to develope products which meet the requirements of the various engineering groups of these vehicle manufacturers.
When one moves out of the "it's my world, and this works for me" realm, moves into the real automotive world, 35 million built last year, things had better be right and no chance of screwing up. One screw up is not bad, but if 10% have a problem, you do the numbers.
Big subject, big area to cover, after all there were only somewhere in the area of 16.5 to 17 MILLION vehicles built in North America last year(35 million world wide), so there is a lot of room for quality companies to sell their products.
Ketch</HTML>
Do it right or don't do it all!
Like has been stated, each has their "endorsements" of what or whatever.
All I can say, is we make "waxes/sealants" with the car companies name on them for Nissan, Renault, DaimlerChrysler, Saab, Saturn, AC/Delco, Ford, and a few others.
We also have the "recommendations" in Technical Service Bulletins, that the dealer or owner may chose to use not only our products, under our ValuGard name brand, but also Mequiar's and 3M.
Not to "knock" other brands, and some such as Eagle One, a divison of Ashland Chemical has VW and Audi's stamp of approval.
At present, Automotive International provides some products to 9 of the 15 largest vehicle manufacturers in the world.
As I said, that does not mean that other companies do not have good products, or even possibly, superior products, it just means that they do not have the finnancial or personel resourses, the time, etc to develope products which meet the requirements of the various engineering groups of these vehicle manufacturers.
When one moves out of the "it's my world, and this works for me" realm, moves into the real automotive world, 35 million built last year, things had better be right and no chance of screwing up. One screw up is not bad, but if 10% have a problem, you do the numbers.
Big subject, big area to cover, after all there were only somewhere in the area of 16.5 to 17 MILLION vehicles built in North America last year(35 million world wide), so there is a lot of room for quality companies to sell their products.
Ketch</HTML>
Do it right or don't do it all!
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